posted June 07, 2005 11:41 AM               

It has taken quite a while but the ineptitude of the management of US auto makers is really hurtung us all in the USA right now. They have had decades of time, warnings, reports, projections, customer surveys and so on telling them what the problems are, but they did not listen. Sure they can advertise about initial quality surveys, but I can't affort a car that falls apart after 100,000 miles! What does the initial quality do for me except look good on the show room floor. The depreciation is high, and the repairs are constant and expensive. Every time I had taken my American car to the shop I would just get more pissed off!

I drive the hell out of the Japanses cars that I have had, and they just keep running. No problems. Even though I spend a little more up front, my overall expense is lowerer and I can predict few repair bills. I hate the random $500 repairs that just kept showing up for my American cars.

Am I un-patriotic? I won't accept the blame. I blame the US auto makers for failing the American people and for the economic fallout because of it. The problems of the American auto maker ripples through the entire US economy.

posted June 07, 2005 05:09 PM               

quote:

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Originally posted by Tom C:
GM just announced the elimination of 25,000 jobs.

It has taken quite a while but the ineptitude of the management of US auto makers is really hurtung us all in the USA right now. They have had decades of time, warnings, reports, projections, customer surveys and so on telling them what the problems are, but they did not listen. Sure they can advertise about initial quality surveys, but I can't affort a car that falls apart after 100,000 miles! What does the initial quality do for me except look good on the show room floor. The depreciation is high, and the repairs are constant and expensive. Every time I had taken my American car to the shop I would just get more pissed off!

I drive the hell out of the Japanses cars that I have had, and they just keep running. No problems. Even though I spend a little more up front, my overall expense is lowerer and I can predict few repair bills. I hate the random $500 repairs that just kept showing up for my American cars.

Am I un-patriotic? I won't accept the blame. I blame the US auto makers for failing the American people and for the economic fallout because of it. The problems of the American auto maker ripples through the entire US economy.

Shame on the greedy, inept, and criminally negligent American auto makers management.

Tom C

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At least Toyota and Honda make cars here in the US......

posted June 07, 2005 06:26 PM               

Tom C

posted June 08, 2005 07:20 AM               

#1 has been, and still is - the Japanese.
#2 has been, and still is - the Europeans.
#3 has been, and still is - the Americana.

After WWII, we Americans implimented QUALITY to the Japanese. They have embraced it widely and still do. While they practice +/- 3 sigma (n-1), we now tout this bull crap of +/- 6 sigma.

Six sigma is like designing a two car garage to park one car into it. This allows American manufacturer's to "get rid of bad quality".

While the advocates of 6 sigma says it saves money - it does - but only for the manufacturers. The excess crap is passed on to and sold to the Consumers. Less scrap - of course. The scrap is crap - and we as consumers simply believe these 6 sigma goofs - no, not "guru's, but 6 sigma "goofs".

The GM thing is only but the beginning. Ford will be next, then maybe Diamer-Crysler. At Diamer-Crysler, they at least think well ahead.

The next time you pass a parking lot at GM - look at the % of vehicles the real line workers are driving.Certainly far from GM products.

Years ago, I fortold the demise of MOTOROLA and their Huntly, IL Plant. The crap coming in from vendors simply did not match up, and BOOM, the new "state-of-the-art" Plant was shuttered with 1000's of workers out of work.

Those "Black-Belt" 6 sigma "goofs" have to wear Wide Black Belts to hide the brown color of thier s*^# they're spewing from their mouths.

One way out of this is to reconsider +/- 3 sigma- period.

posted June 08, 2005 08:20 AM               

I think you have a misunderstanding about the 6 sigma concept. Additionally I'm not so sure the car companies have adopted it yet.

Tom C

posted June 13, 2005 08:43 PM               

Take one value (e.g. 0.012) and use it as the "sigma" data point for both the +/-6 & then the +/-3 data. Now spread it out on a bell shaped curve, with "zero" as the centerline.

You'll quickly realize that the "tight" bell shaped curve is the +/- 3 sigma one.

I'll agree on one point though. The wider the bell shaped curve, the more a manufacturer can get rid of their junk (purpurtedly less defects). However, that's exactly hat they want. Why not +/-12 sigma???

posted June 13, 2005 09:15 PM               

If you don't mind I've started a 6 sigma thread because I think the Auto issue and the 6 sigma issue are different things. I do agree that the auto makers have missed the quality boat.

Quality is a tough thing to define sometimes. I think the US car makers generally define quality as how pretty the car looks on the dealers lot. For a lot of people quality really means how controlled a ride the car has and how well the car hold up after 100,000 miles. I believe the US car makers really missed out on these concepts. I had a Ford Tarus when they first came out. It drove great and the car magazines sang their praises. The Tarus held up fairly well also, will a few seriuous defects however. A couple of years later I drove a newer Taurus edition. They had engineered all the goodness out of the car and turned it into the standard issue US POS. Why? The Taurus then died a slow miserable death.

They just don't get it.

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Best Regards,

Tom Cunningham

Extrusion Technical Services

posted November 21, 2005 04:11 PM               

This is a shame and lays squarley in the hands of the people who mis-managed the company.

The upper management past and present, should lose their jobs and their pensions. This is little consolation to the damage they have done to the US economy, workforce and pride.

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Best Regards,

Tom Cunningham

Extrusion Technical Services

posted November 24, 2005 04:13 AM               

I want to speak with you about a few things that I might be able to help you on.

Can you send me your E-mail address and include your phone # to zsite1@cs.com?

Relative to THIS overall "quality" subject though, I still stand firm on my posting of June 08, 2005.

QUALITY = Asian, Euo, and then last place, USA. The majority of Americans have never seen a Chinese car yet on our roads. Once they up production for their own consumption, God only knows where the Petrol will come from. I have not seen even a hint at hybrids.

I agree with you on GM's wishy-washy decisions of their management, but the debt to service ratio is about at 2.5:1 now. This means that as ~ 2.5% who retire now, GM can financhially only hire 1 person to replace the 2.5 people
who do retire now. The real truth Tom? GM has reached the level of folding or holding.

Personally, I feel they will have to fold, and this time, there will be no US Government backing them as Chryler did years ago.

Diamer-Crysler was savvy enough to tap into the infamous nameplates that came along with the Chrysler buy deal.

Very smart of them, to also survey what YOUNG blood wants - rather than guess. Who would ever think that the JEEP which was used against them in WWII would now have 11 or 12 spin off names of the JEEP lineup now?

They (Diamer-Chrysler)will survive. Personally, I feel strongly that FORD will be next in line to either harness up with a Company outside the USA, or just sign off. FORD too has many many quality issues to address.

posted November 24, 2005 09:04 AM               

The only reasonable argument is that the US economy would be impacted negativily if I don't support GM until they had a chance to "catch up". I heard the same argument 35 years ago during the first oil crisis. I think they have been given enough time.

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Best Regards,

Tom Cunningham

Extrusion Technical Services